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Thread: ATT: Announcement concering the future of MNRL (ALL INTERESTED DRIVERS, PLEASE READ)

  1. #21
    Jason Whited's Avatar
    Jason Whited is offline Senior Community Leader
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    Joe has a server up and running, but not on the CMS servers for tonight (there is a race in another sim on the server currently).
    We've put up some base content to test settings and such. Server name, and password details are the same as they are here.
    Currently running is Formula Retro at Interlagos '76.
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  2. #22
    davidan's Avatar
    davidan is offline David Anderson
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    I will definitely join you guys for some of these races now that we are on AMS!!! Great stuff!
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  3. #23
    Marc Cohn is online now Senior Member
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    I'm going to start this off by saying I am rather sad that MNRL is leaving rFactor again. rFactor, quirks and all, has been an amazing sim for so many years and has given such a great base to which thousands of cars and tracks have been used for various mods. However, for some silly reason, the matchmaker is now permanently gone unless you are using the Steam version, the sim only supports a total of 3 USB devices when some like myself have 5-6 that are used regularly, and the optimization can be a hassle at times as I've found with the Steam version actually running slower than the standalone copy.

    The last time I raced in an online league race in Automobilista, the frame rates were well optimized and the sim as a whole looked like what would happen if rFactor's guts were taken and turned into something absolutely glorious. The sim has a lot going for it and while I support the change, I do have one request of the admins. I know it may take some effort to convert the necessary cars and tracks, but I'd greatly appreciate it if you could continue with keeping MNRL as a historic racing league. That's the MNRL I've seen since I started racing there back at Race2Play in 2013 and I'd love nothing more than to be able to race around in machines like the GTPs I ran my first race in, the SCCA Class C and E where we had Datsun 240Zs and Sunbeam Tigers, the vintage infamous Trans Am beasts and the Ferrari 250 Testa Rossa that Norm was kind enough to let me try back in the day.
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  4. #24
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    I think and feel that Norm would approve this move. Well planned. Good job Jason and Joe. This should be a smoother transition than the earlier one when MNRL was still at R2P.

    If I can fix my wheel setting problems with AMS I will try to join some of the races as well.
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  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc Cohn View Post
    I'm going to start this off by saying I am rather sad that MNRL is leaving rFactor again. rFactor, quirks and all, has been an amazing sim for so many years and has given such a great base to which thousands of cars and tracks have been used for various mods. However, for some silly reason, the matchmaker is now permanently gone unless you are using the Steam version, the sim only supports a total of 3 USB devices when some like myself have 5-6 that are used regularly, and the optimization can be a hassle at times as I've found with the Steam version actually running slower than the standalone copy.

    The last time I raced in an online league race in Automobilista, the frame rates were well optimized and the sim as a whole looked like what would happen if rFactor's guts were taken and turned into something absolutely glorious. The sim has a lot going for it and while I support the change, I do have one request of the admins. I know it may take some effort to convert the necessary cars and tracks, but I'd greatly appreciate it if you could continue with keeping MNRL as a historic racing league. That's the MNRL I've seen since I started racing there back at Race2Play in 2013 and I'd love nothing more than to be able to race around in machines like the GTPs I ran my first race in, the SCCA Class C and E where we had Datsun 240Zs and Sunbeam Tigers, the vintage infamous Trans Am beasts and the Ferrari 250 Testa Rossa that Norm was kind enough to let me try back in the day.
    You have matchmaker with your Steam version of rF?
    I have Steam version and I'm not seeing that yet...still having to manually do it.

    Don't want to get into it too much right here as we'll conflate the thread's intended purpose, but in response to " the optimization can be a hassle at times as I've found with the Steam version actually running slower than the standalone copy."

    Frankly, with your machine, this is not an issue you should be having in rF, Steam version or not.
    With what you've discussed about this issue, I've come to suspect you have deeper rooted issues in your machine somewhere. There's absolutely no reason rF should be straining your system in any way. Something outside the sim itself is causing issues and the only way you're ever going to know for sure is to do some logging of some data, and some comparison, etc.

    Of course, while it has become easier over time, none of these sims ever really boasted about being "plug and play" and the long optimization process is often part of the gig. We have to keep that in mind.

    ..................................

    To address the other part of your post....
    MNRL was and will always be historic racing.
    While we may (and do intend) to branch out slightly with some different stuff, we aren't straying far from the historic stuff.
    1 - We are part of the "historics division" here at CMS...so the name says it all. And, if we do branch out with some racing in more modern cars, etc...well, I'd rather not get into that right now because we end up spending all our time discussing something that may be way off in the future at this time (or something that may never come to fruition...this isn't an exact science, per say...so never really know what we'll pull from the hat)

    But yes, to answer that directly....MNRL will be running vintage/classic/historic cars of all types well into the future. It is what we do!

    ............................
    P.S....just for you, Marc. Since we've had this discussion a few times.
    You will be happy that the footing amongst the left/right footed brakers will be set a bit more even now.
    Not sure if you've dabbled around in the sim enough yet, but when you do, check out the initiative approach to the manual gearbox and the ability to actually slip and miss gears if you don't engage the clutch properly (it's not perfect, but I challenge anyone to find a sim doing it better right now)
    So, that alone should make you dance....hehe (Sure does me!)
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  6. #26
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    Handy tip for those that may have issues getting everything set up properly in AMS.

    Go into Steam. Go to your Steam library. On the left hand side of the screen there will be a list of all your Steam games.
    Right click on Automobilista. In that list of options you will see an option for "manual". It's a pdf file....click it, it'll open in your browser.
    Lots of helpful stuff in there.

    A link to the manual. Not sure it will work if you don't own the sim yet, but should.
    file:///C:/Program%20Files%20(x86)/Steam/steamapps/common/Automobilista/support/Automobilista_User_Guide_EN.pdf

    ^^Won't direct link...but follow the instructions I listed there, you'll find it easy enough.
    Last edited by Jason Whited; 12-22-2017 at 08:51 AM.
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  7. #27
    Bill Brehm's Avatar
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    I'll probably get the game, but I don't really see that it has anything on rf2. Not a modder so I don't know how big that mountain is, but if I were I'd probably also go the easy route. Nonetheless, AMS seems like flogging an old horse with a new saddle.

    Quick update. Installing now.
    Last edited by Bill Brehm; 12-22-2017 at 08:38 AM.
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  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Brehm View Post
    I'll probably get the game, but I don't really see that it has anything on rf2. Not a modder so I don't know how big that mountain is, but if I were I'd probably also go the easy route. Nonetheless, AMS seems like flogging an old horse with a new saddle.

    Quick update. Installing now.
    It's a more well rounded product than rF2.
    With rF2, it's hit and miss with content. Some tracks are up to par, same with cars...but some is really poor quality and lazily done conversions.
    The modding community, while moving back to rF2 a bit recently, has all but disappeared in comparison to other sims.

    One could literally say that any sim that isn't "the cutting edge" (whatever that is) is just flogging an old horse. With that frame of reference, this entire endeavor of sim racing becomes completely meaningless.

    This mountain you speak of, it's HUGE.
    With AMS, this is not the case, as I briefly mentioned. The reasons are far more in depth than that, but I'll leave that to others if they wish to pursue that knowledge.

    Besides tire deformation and side wall deflection, etc (the complex tire models) of rF2....rF2 doesn't really offer us any features that we won't have here. The AMS tire models are quite complex in their own right. Flatspotting, blistering, tire/dirt pickup..all these things are a "thing" in this sim (making it far more advanced in just that regard than the old rF), just as any other more modern sims. Actually, I find they do it better than many others. I spend a hefty amount of time in AC, rF2, rF1, and AMS...thousands of hours (literally) in the past year. (near ashamed to mention the actual hours I've put in...lol) AMS feels the best, by far, to me.
    Not to mention, in build 1.50 we're going to get limited tire sets and a cool online ranking system (beta, I think)....along with other features that have come in recent months.
    Read the release notes I've posted in this thread...and the dev notes over the course of the last few years. This sim has grown and advanced leaps and bounds.

    Every single time I walk away from time in AMS, I am left with a smile on my face.
    Every time I leave rF2, it's in frustration and/or anger because I spend all my time trying to get it to work as it should (the optimization in rF2 is absolutely horrible....on a defending the sim note though, perhaps that will change with the new updates...I didn't test enough yesterday, but I'm not really interested at this point anyways)

    Sure, it's not DX11 quality. It's not as advanced in some places as a few others. But, it has pros that outweigh those cons and those pros even go as far as to outweigh "pros" from the likes of rF2 or others in the bigger scheme of things. And, they are doing things literally no one else is doing.
    They listen...they respond...they communicate constantly with their users.
    That alone is enough that we in the sim racing community should support them. Buying this sim is a VERY small price to pay for the content we get. Heck, it's a steal, really.

    P.S. I see you are installing. I'll quit trying to sell you on it now and let the sim do the job for me.
    Last edited by Jason Whited; 12-22-2017 at 08:56 AM.
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  9. #29
    AngeloRacer's Avatar
    AngeloRacer is offline Angelo dos Santos
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    Talking about historic content to race with.
    AMS have excelent base content.
    To mention the ones that comes to my mind right now:
    Formula Retro (F1 70s), Formula Vintage (F1 60s), Formula Vee (School formulas used since the 80s), Opalas 80s and 86s (drive it, you will like it!), Beetle Cup (with Beetles from the 80s), and several touring cars from brazil´s history on the 80s and very early 90s.

    Even the Aussie Racing Car I mentioned, is very raw. Completely mecanic and you have to drive it like a historic car to keep it in one piece.

    So there is a lot of base content to play with for a very long time or even while the MNRL content is not ready for a proper conversion.
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  10. #30
    Jason Whited's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AngeloRacer View Post
    Talking about historic content to race with.
    AMS have excelent base content.
    To mention the ones that comes to my mind right now:
    Formula Retro (F1 70s), Formula Vintage (F1 60s), Formula Vee (School formulas used since the 80s), Opalas 80s and 86s (drive it, you will like it!), Beetle Cup (with Beetles from the 80s), and several touring cars from brazil´s history on the 80s and very early 90s.

    Even the Aussie Racing Car I mentioned, is very raw. Completely mecanic and you have to drive it like a historic car to keep it in one piece.

    So there is a lot of base content to play with for a very long time or even while the MNRL content is not ready for a proper conversion.
    And we'll be utilizing some of that content you speak of, Angelo.
    I've gathered up some really cool add on content too. Some liveries for some of these unlicensed series that make them look like the real deal (the 1975 F1 liveries for the Formula Retros, for one, are really nice)...all very easy to add on...and doesn't overwrite base content (nice little way they've set that up that I'll expand on later when we get to that stuff)

    In the future, we do intend to bring some MNRL mods to AMS..but we'll only do so when we can do it PROPERLY...There will be no lazily converted materials from us. It will be at AMS standards, or it will not be published. (I HATE lazily done conversions, in case no one could tell...lol)

    The Formula Retros, in particular, are some of my favorite cars in existence in any sim.
    Some time on track (finally) with a human being (Joe) last night at our test server (Interlagos '76) said to me that a series in those in the future will be REALLY good. Very fun cars to go wheel to wheel in.
    (I get mesmerized when following, always checking out the suspension details...lol They look and feel really cool and as I would imagine them to be.)

    For me, Reiza physics are the best on the market, without a doubt. They nail it each and every time. And that lends so much to the immersion fact...it's really amazing to me, still, how "real" and alive these simulated cars can truly be.
    Last edited by Jason Whited; 12-22-2017 at 09:13 AM.
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